Rescued: One Woman's Sex & Porn Addiction Ep.18

Sarah Annie Schneider: Welcome to the Addicted to God Podcast. I'm Sarah Schneider, and I am addicted to God. The Addicted to God Podcast is a safe, biblical space where hurting people learn to transfer their addictions, whether to substances, approval, relationships, pain, success, or anything else, into a life-giving addiction to God Himself. it's for anyone who knows something has to change. You're stuck in cycles that are stealing your peace, relationships, or future. And you sense God is the only real answer. Through honest conversations, scriptured-centered teaching, and real stories, including interviews with both men and women, we will help you break free and pursue God with the same desperation that you once chased other things. I am so glad you're here. So, thank you for joining me, and let's get addicted to. To God together. Today we have an incredible topic that I don't think many people associate to women. And I've got a guest here today and I'm thrilled to introduce you to Andrea Saloma. Welcome, Andrea. Hi Sarah. Thanks for having me. So glad you're here, Andrea. And I can't wait to hear your story. So before we dive in, could you please share just a little bit about you? Yeah. So, like you said, Sarah, my name is Andrea. My husband Dominic and I will be celebrating eleven years of marriage this summer. We have two young kids at home and currently we are in my favorite season, which is summer. I always joke and say we are a solar-powered family because we come alive when the sun is out. I always joke with friends and say, I just think, when after long winters and stuff, there's like just a little part of me that feels like it dies inside. And the sun comes out and I'm like, okay, I'm alive again. And and so I'm just thankful for the warmth and thankful to be here. And I'm thankful for, wherever God takes this conversation. Well, and I am as well. I want to get to know you a little bit better. And I think it would be intriguing for you to share with us what was the greatest addiction or stronghold that you've battled in your life. And if you're comfortable, share when and how it started and what life felt like when you were entrapped in it. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I grew up going to church with my family and had a wonderful Sunday school teacher. I appreciated that my church really encouraged salvation and baptism for young kids. I know that God took hold of my heart sometime when I was young elementary age. I can't really remember the specifics, but I remember wanting to get baptized around ten or eleven, and so I did. I just don't remember a time not knowing and walking with Jesus, which is kind of great and what I hope for in my kids. So although I'm blessed to have known Jesus and had a relationship with him for most of my life, it wasn't always easy. My walk with God had peaks and valleys, and there were definitely times that I struggled with my faith. I grew up in purity culture, which overall I just want to say I'm not here to criticize or bash purity culture. I think the premise of it came from a place of good motive and good heart. Our world was seeing a rise in AIDS and teen pregnancies, so the government started the abstinence movement. But churches wanted something more biblical than straight abstinence. So they came up with this word purity. And I'm sure there were churches out there that taught purity and holiness really well. But somewhere along the way, churches, maybe out of fear or panic that their congregation would have a teen pregnancy, they started using purity as this sort of perfection standard. And if you weren't pure, then you were tainted and and who would want you? And And some youth groups, some people might have memories of their youth groups using metaphors of used items, and if it got used too much, like no one's gonna want it. my youth group did the same thing, and I just I think they kind of missed the mark when it came to grace, almost like it was purity or nothing at all. And I I would say I was a pretty good kid for the most part. I tried to follow the rules, get good grades. I avoided the party lifestyle most of high school, but in my senior year of high school, I started to really struggle with feeling seen and wanted. And and that's the vocabulary that's gonna kind of come back multiple times. It's just wanting to be seen and wanting to be wanted. imperfections and all. All of my friends were having boyfriends or dates to dances, and I never really felt like I was noticed, and I started to let That affect my confidence and how I saw myself. I wasn't letting God tell me who I was as much as I was letting the world. so I started to compromise. The first time I was invited to a party, a guy actually took notice of me. I put myself in a vulnerable position and ended up alone with him in a van. And things happened that I didn't want to happen, but saying no felt riskier, so I just gave in. This was the beginning of me looking to be seen. And wanted, but not looking to God for it. Fast forward, I'm in college. I'm falling into this pattern where I give myself over to a guy hoping for true connection and relationship, only left to be feeling used and discarded. At some point I got exposed to porn while in college. And the thing about porn is that people who find themselves in a porn addiction do not just wake up one day and say, I want to be addicted to porn. The same can be said of any addiction. Addiction is always about a symptom of something deeper. Often sexual trauma can get channeled into compulsive sexual behavior like porn or graphic romance novels. I was in a support group for women who had been victims of some type of abuse. And when we got to the topic of sexual behavior, the majority of the women around the table had some sort of interaction with porn, either presently or in the past. And so that was my addiction. porn. I was a quote unquote good Christian woman who had a secret struggle with porn. I put good in quotes because of course I was not good, but that was the perception I led people to believe. When I started dating who is now my husband, I was able to give it up for a little bit and then thought, if I never struggle again, I don't have to tell him everything. But it always lasted for a little bit. And what I thought I could break, I ended up bringing into my marriage. Addictions are always about something deeper. This had nothing to do with my husband, what he was or wasn't for me. It was about past trauma that I wasn't giving to God. And so sometimes actually like single people, I've met with single women who have a porn struggle and they'll say, I just think it's because I'm single I need a sexual release or whatever. And I say to them, it's it's not about the singleness. I've been single. And I'm married and I brought it into my marriage and you will tell yourself this lie of like once I'm married, it'll just go away and I can say from personal experience it didn't go away and it won't go away because it's not about the porn. It's about looking to something other than God. There are so many things in your story and thank you for sharing that. I think Every person listening to this is going to relate to you on some level, especially in our youth and adolescence when we are seeking identity and we are looking to find acceptance. I think you really summarized it real well. And I think so many of us have similar paths, honestly. And it does lend me to ask a question about the purity culture. it sounds very condemning. It sounds like it was very bad girl, good girl. There was a fine line right there. you probably felt condemned for sliding into that bad girl space against the purity culture that you were held to a higher expectation. Would would you agree? Yeah, I would say with purity culture. Where I think they got it wrong was honestly even with this word purity in general. Because, in the Bible in general, I don't think we're called to the standard of purity. We're called to a standard of holiness that's what I read in the Bible is holiness, which is to be set apart. We're meant to be set apart. And and yes, maybe purity plays a part in that, but with the word purity, the reason why. just in general our cultures kind of just rejected it is because it really was an all or nothing thing. And that's what my youth group taught mine included like the example of a used car and they would say, every time you have compromised yourself sexually with relationships, it's basically like another person driving your car. And by the time you had, you know, 10 sexual experiences before you're married, you're this used car and who wants to drive off a parking lot with a used car when you could have a new car. I don't think they meant to really hurt a generation of people sexually. I think it just came from a place of fear and not trusting God. And that's what can happen sometimes when we're not trusting God. And they they lost the grace in that process. And so some girls like myself, when you'd kind of compromise one time All of a sudden it's like, well, it's an all or nothing thing. I'm damaged good, so what's the point of trying to not compromise again? Because who's gonna want me? And so I'd compromise more and more. and it just kind of just spiraled and I didn't really know how to turn it around. No one was talking to me about grace. No one was talking to me about how God saw me in spite of my sexual brokenness. And why sex? I heard you say, you weren't getting attention from men. then when you finally got some attention, it almost became an all or nothing. Like, why not alcohol like other people or drugs or or something else? Like what was it that drew sex to becoming that dominant addiction or stronghold in your life? I think it's natural biology of how we are created as sexual beings made for relationship and made for connection. I didn't have a lot of that growing up. I didn't go too much into this, but I didn't have a lot of deep connection with my parents growing up. And so I didn't have people in my life that I felt like I could really connect with deeply. And because we were made for connection and community and intimacy, I was just trying to find an outlet to get that that's why we crave relationship, right? We weren't meant to be alone and when a guy would show attention and he would ignite that part of me that is actually good. the part of me that Because God designed it. Yeah, God designed us to long for intimacy, not just, relationally and emotionally, but also physically. Like He made that. sex in marriage in its proper place is a very good thing. And and it wasn't wrong for me to like long for that connection, but I wasn't longing for it in the right way at the right time. Absolutely. so I think for me that's why this the sexual part became a struggle with the porn is because I was looking for what God had already put into me, but I didn't have the right boundaries in my life and people that I felt like I could connect to at home. to help me make sense of my body. I think that's another big part of it. It was this all or nothing thing. there wasn't really good healthy conversations around sex and the hormones going through my body and how to, have control over that. And Honor God with it. And I talk about like a with like the holiness and having holiness and integrity over the way God made my body, including the hormones, not being able to have like good conversations because it's like an all or nothing thing. You're either pure or you're not. that's where the conversation ended. But what about all the in between? What about what am I supposed to do with these hormones when a when a guy touches me and I'm like, Well, I didn't really want it, I'm not ready for that because I was told you can't do it. But that also felt Good. So now what? Like what am I supposed to do? With very confusing. This confusing message of like that felt good to my body, but I'm also riddled with shame now. I'm gonna ask you something that I can edit out if you're not comfortable with me adding this to the conversation, but I don't know that a lot of people understand what porn is. I think some people think it's taking a magazine of nude people and hiding away and and having this secret life with pages or in the modern day internet and websites. And you hear all the time about people that are fired from their jobs or or arrested for being pedophiles or whatever. And I'm just I guess I wanna better understand what porn is. I'm coming at this from a complete naive place Yeah. I'm not sure I have like the textbook answer to what porn is, but I would just say in general, if someone's coming and talking to me about just any type of sexual struggle, I would just use this word integrity if whether you're married or you're single, are you having integrity over your body? rather than putting porn in a box and saying this is porn, this is not, I I wanna make it a bigger category of just sexual integrity in general and say, if you're a single person, are you having integrity over your body not even watching movies that are too provocative that are just igniting this desire for lust and exposing you to impure. So I would just say anything that ignites a desire or a longing for lust of someone that does not belong to you in marriage is is not sexual integrity, whether you're married or you're single. whether you're watching a movie that's not quote unquote porn, but it might as well be because sometimes these movies that are rated art, like in my opinion, might as well be because the scenes are just so graphic. so in our house we have a very high boundary on what we watch. and so that's just like I think how I would answer that question is what are you looking at? What are you reading? And and protecting yourself, basically. thank you for that. And I appreciate that you're like, don't put porn in a box. It's broader. you're absolutely right. of all of this, being that it was such a difficult stronghold, how did God work in your life to replace that addiction with a deeper hunger for him and his word? What role did he play in your transformation away from that? Yeah. So like I Had said I had brought porn into my marriage as a secret. My husband did not know about it. We had been married for four years. My husband came home from a weekend retreat and we were discussing his weekend like we normally would. after I had thought the conversation was over, I had grabbed the TV remote to put on one of our favorite shows. And he grabs the remote from my hand, turns off the TV, holds my hand, and tells me he had been looking at porn in our marriage. And my heart sank. Not because my husband was looking at porn, but because I was and I was not ready to confess. I had no plan to confess ever. I was taking the secret to the grave. My husband joined a local support group and part of that program. They asked the couples to remain absent for the first 90 days of recovery. And so we did. And when the 90 days were up, the pastor leading this group asked to meet with us before we reunified sexually just to make sure I was okay. And keep in mind Dominic has no idea of my struggle. So meanwhile, I am just drowning inside. The conviction of the Holy Spirit was ripping me apart. I knew deep down I couldn't live like this. I was just sick to my stomach over my sin, but it felt riskier to share. I felt like I could justify my husband's struggle because the church seemed to help address the struggle of porn for men much better than they did for women. You talked about it earlier, this one is it's just a little taboo, more taboo when when it comes to women. I will say I think the church has actually come a long when it comes to the conversation of porn and women. But at the time when this is all going on, I felt like I was alone. I really was not hearing podcast conversations about women and porn. I was hearing it about men. That's also what sin does to us though. Sin drives us to isolation. So I want to put a broad stroke on that as well, not to interrupt. I'm so sorry. No, but yeah, that's what it was. It's like Satan was wanting me to stay hidden because he wanted me to think I was alone. So The morning comes, we're supposed to be meeting with the pastor after our 90 days of abstinence. And I remember I'm sitting down at the kitchen table and I am just frantically searching my Bible to see if there's any way I could keep this struggle to myself. Like, God, there's gotta be a passage of scripture in here that can justify what I've been doing. And I'm like begging God, like, give me a verse, give me a verse. Like I can't, I cannot share this. He will never understand. Like This is not a woman's struggle. He's never gonna understand. He's not gonna love me. I'm gonna be gross to him. I'm gonna be rejected. And and I'm just like, I don't know. I'm gonna wing it. I'm just gonna get through this and I'm not gonna tell him. I was going into that meeting not going to tell my husband. So we get to the pastor's office and he starts our time asking Dominic whether he was caught or if he confessed. And my husband's a good man, and he confessed. Then he asked me what my reaction was and I told them I was like, Well, I'm surprised by it, but I'm happy he's taking responsibility, joining the support group, and just ready to put this behind us. And I'm telling you, Sarah, I might as well have had a sticker on my forehead that said, Ask her if she's looking at porn too, because I believe, you know, the Holy Spirit just imparted on him. Like he saw right through my response and knew that something wasn't right because What I learned later learned was that most wives, when they find out their husbands looking at porn, are much more emotional and furious. I mean, rightly so it is it is a betrayal. So like you're so nonchalant, like just like whatever, like can we just move on? And so I mean, this is like he's a pastor news counselor, so like red flag, red flag, right? So he knew something wasn't right. in his wisdom, he he asked Dominic, what do you think of your wife's reaction? Dominic, he he didn't really think it was anything about porn. He just is like, well, I'm confused because, he would share the men who are married at my table, their wives, would lose it. they were kicking them out or making them sleep on the couch or just, you know, throwing out laptops. And I'm over here it's sad, but I just want to be past it. this was a a red flag to the pastor that I wasn't telling the truth. So he asked Dominic, Do you believe your wife? And Dominic said, I think she's not telling me something. And it wasn't because he thought I wasn't being honest about my own struggle. He just thought maybe I wasn't being honest about how mad I was. He was thinking, like, I think she's more mad than what she's really letting on. the pastor looks at me and Are you not telling him something? I take a shift. I want to be free so bad. But going back to purity culture, it just has overtaken. I think it's purity or nothing in my head. I'm like, I don't want to be nothing to my husband, but I'm not pure. So what am I? And so my head is sunken. My eyes are down, and I say quietly to the pastor. He asked me, Are you not telling him something? And I say, Yes. So the pastor asked if I wanted to share, and I just shake my head. My eyes are to the floor. I can't look up anymore. I'm just the shame is it's too much. It's overwhelming me. And the Holy Spirit, I am a Christian, keep in mind. I have the Holy Spirit's conviction and it's screaming at me. Just trust me, Andrea. Trust me. And I couldn't. Like Sarah, I was drowning and I couldn't save myself. And I think that's the whole point. I was trying to save myself and I couldn't. I want to talk a little bit about kindness. This was something I had heard on a podcast. and it really, it really resonated with me. And I think it's true, true of what I experienced in this office that day. Romans 2, 4 says, the kindness of God leads to repentance. And so the next thing this pastor did in his wisdom was show me the kindness of Jesus. He knew I had a story that I couldn't share because. I I had shame and I I think he could just read that all over my body language. So he said, I want to tell you a story, Andrea. And you can find this story in John chapter four. In the middle of the day, Jesus was resting by a well while his disciples went into the village. A Samaritan woman comes along alone to draw water, which is already suspicious because most of the women would come early in the morning before it got too hot. But this woman wants to be alone. She wants to hide. Jesus asks her to give him a drink, which surprised her because Jews would typically have nothing to do with Samaritans. So she asks Jesus why he would want a drink from her, a Samaritan woman, and Jesus replies, If you knew who I am, you'd ask me for living water. She's confused by this because Jesus has no rope, he has no bucket. What is this living water he's talking about? And Jesus tells her, Anyone who drinks this water from this well will become thirsty again, but those who drink the water I give will never be thirsty again. And she asks him to give her this water. Now here's the part to pay close attention to what Jesus does next. He tells her to go and get her husband. Her heart sinks. She knows what she's doing is wrong. She answers truthfully though, I don't have a husband. she replies. In Jesus' kindness, he now exposes her. He says, You're right, you don't have a husband, for you've had five husbands and you aren't even married to the man you're living with now. Why? Why did Jesus do this? Why did he expose her like that? To embarrass her? To shame her? No. Exposure for Jesus is never about shame. It's about love. He wanted her to be fully known so she could be fully loved. The story goes on and he tells her that he is the Messiah. And the woman runs back to the village and tells everyone, Come and see the man who told me everything about I've done what I've done. So back in the pastor's office after he shares this story, he gives me another chance to share. And I just start at the beginning and confess everything. I confess the first time I looked and how it grew and how there were times in our marriage when I betrayed our covenant. And while I'm sharing all of this, my head is down, my eyes are swollen with tears. And the next thing I see is my dear husband kneeling down on the floor in front of me, grabbing my hands. And telling me he loves me, and I become undone. The biggest fear that had crippled me for years just obliterated. It wasn't true, the lies I was telling myself, that if my husband truly knew me, he wouldn't love me. It wasn't true that I was disgusting or horrible. But here's what was true: that while I was still a sinner, My husband loves me, and God loves me. Okay. That's a lot and so powerful. I'm imagining women and men honestly listening to this podcast and hearing your story and feeling a sense of relief because they too could be holding in something that they think they cannot share, that they need to keep a secret, if the truth were to come out exactly the opposite of what's true. their greatest fears would be exposed. And you are not only taking your own testimony, your your moment of confession, and being vulnerable and broken to let the hand of God step in And change your marriage and and your life, right? Just like literally released you from these chains. Is that the best way I can describe it? That was the moment I was set free. Yep. And the chains were released. I also want to hone in on something you said, I was a Christian, mind you. And so often I think that too comes with the perception that we have to have it all together and that because you have Jesus or you follow Jesus or you go to church or you read your Bible that you've esteemed yourself to some level of being immune to brokenness or immune to sin or immune to bad things. what message would you have for people who are like How can you call yourself a Christian? Or how do you know you were a Christian if you entered down that path so far? Yeah. How did I know? There was a point in my life where I wrestled with, Am I fake? And I had it I had to wrestle with that question because I did grow up in the church. And so there was a part of me, and this was after my confession to my husband, I joined a support group. And that was the question I brought to my support group is like, I don't know if I'm a real Christian or not, because of that very thing of like, how could I have gotten so lost in this addiction and claim to be a follower of God? aren't I supposed to be bearing fruit and not struggling with this kind of stuff? And the thing that helped me unpack that question that I had to wrestle with, am I real or not? Because I have just kind of just known Jesus all my life. I don't really have a recollection of like some people just have that clear day of I know I surrendered my life to God this day because they didn't grow up in a Christian household. I didn't have that. I felt like I did genuinely accept God. as a young girl and I don't really remember life before I don't think I had a life before him, honestly. So I had to wrestle with that in my support group. And the thing that they kind of helped me unpack was just the conviction part of it of just like when you have the Holy Spirit inside of you and they're like that's not a it's not a shame message, it's a conviction because you know this is chains, this is slavery, the sin. You're a slave to something, right? It's either God or sin. And you know, you're not supposed to be. Doing this, especially keeping it a secret from your husband. and the fact that I knew that that whole time and I would have these moments where I'd come back to God and I would just feel better when I was with God. But then something would trip me up. And that's just the hard part about addiction, is like I didn't want it. And that's the other part where I knew I knew I was saved. I knew I was I supposed to be holy, right? I'm supposed to be set apart and I'm supposed to live to this higher. calling of sanctification. And so that's how I knew God had really taken hold of me at a young age, because I had that Holy Spirit, which is which is different. Conviction is different than shame. Conviction is you are set apart. You are called to this perfection standard of Jesus. We were made in the image of God. We are made to be like him. And so when we're not doing that, we're going to feel that we're going to feel the weight of not being who we are made to be. And that's what I was feeling. So that's how I can say, I knew through and through God was inside of me. And I would cling to him and I would run to him and say, help me God with this. But like I said before, there was always something deeper. And I thought I thought I just had to remove the porn and like that was it. But God was trying to peel back layers and show me no, there's something more going on here. Than just the porn. It's not it's not even really about the porn at the end of the day. It's about trying to find my worth and my value and being seen and loved by people and things of this world, then God. And my outlet was porn. Your outlet might be shopping, your outlet might be drugs, your outlet outlet might be success and having to be the best. Everyone's got an outlet. For me it was porn because of just this need for connection and relationship. But I think most Christians have something that they're turning to. We call them deeper idols. and that was mine. Yeah. God used your story. You mentioned earlier that you've mentored other women. You have had other people come to you that you've been able to give advice to. what advice would you give to people who are listening that may be struggling with this? And also, what starting point you would offer? For them. The first message that I want to share, because I believed this for so long, was that you are not alone. if you start believing that you're alone and there's no help for you, that's right where the enemy wants you and he wants you to stay there. But you need to shine light on it. Satan wants you to believe you're alone and he wants you to stay hidden. And We learned this coping strategy from the very first sinners, Adam and Eve. They taught us how to hide and we've been hiding ever since. But it is impossible for people to help what they can't see. And the more I started opening up about it, the more I learned that people do want to help. There were people, good Christian women that wanted to help me. So my first advice is just to fight the urge to hide and find a good Christian. support group or counselor. I emphasize Christian support group because I think the next step after that would I just want to walk them through surrendering their life to Jesus. Scripture tells us in John 15 5 that apart from Jesus we can do nothing. So trying to break an addiction apart from God might work temporarily. It did for me. I would always be able to kind of break it for a month or two, but it was never able to get to the deepest part of my longings and really what the root cause of the addiction was. We are created beings who are made in the image of a creator. And so any program that tries to help solve addictions apart from Jesus are always gonna fall short because they're denying the very core of who we are made to be, which is J Jesus image bearers. So that would be my first step. And and I just wanna pause for a moment before I move on to like the next step and talk about how I I just acknowledge how very hard this first step is, like the confession part and finding a Christian support group or counselor, because maybe you have tried that. Like maybe that's where you as far as you've gotten. And then rather than getting acceptance and love and grace like I did in that counselor's office. maybe you got rejected or even more shame added on to you. And I just want to say I understand. That's my story too. I actually did try to confess in a women's Bible study that I was in just to kind of like test the waters. I was married, I was really struggling, but I wasn't ready to confess to Dominic. So I was like, I'll just try to confess this to my women's Bible study that I was in at the time. And that experience did not go well. They were not ready for that. They weren't ready for me to bear them with that and they didn't really know how to handle it. just offer them grace, I would say like they probably regret how they reacted, but they didn't react well. that kind of left me feeling with more shame of just like, nope, this is too much. Like if these group of women cannot handle it, my husband cannot handle it. then I just was sure just never gonna share it because I tried it once and it didn't work. And I just wanna say, just keep trying because there are truly people that care and that will offer you the compassion and the grace, and just the love that you need. So don't don't give up on trying to find a support group and don't give up on Jesus. Like he rebuked those who were harsh and critical of those in sin. His heart is for the sinner, his heart is for you and the addicted and the broken. He loves you so much, right where you are. Addiction and all. Scripture tells us that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. you don't have to get it right before you get to church. come to church as you are and find. some help. So you need that support group. You need accountability in your life. You need someone to check in with you and discuss a recovery journey and plan. You need regular meetings with people that can be encouragement and motivation and accountability. And also it helps to go through like a curriculum with people to help you unpack why the addiction, what are your triggers? What is the story of what even led you into the addiction? What are the temptations for you? And then help you come up with like exercises and strategy to break the addiction. a popular curriculum for porn specifically is called Facing the Shadow by Patrick Carnes. And then third is just take some accountability for your own life. Using software like Covenant Eyes or Effer Accountable are some great resources to help set up guardrails in your life. And then lastly is learn from your relapses. Have an accountability partner that you can talk to. you're not gonna get it right the first time. you might set up good strategy for how you're gonna try to have accountability in your life, but there's gonna be things that trigger you and and you're gonna have a slip up, but that doesn't mean it didn't work and it doesn't mean you're broken. It just means you learn from it. So when you have a relapse, And you've been trying to not look at porn but you did it anyways, take an autopsy of your slip. what were the things that led up to why you acted out? And what happened to days leading up to that? Were you not spending time in the Bible and spending too much time watching TV and now these messages are filling your head? what caught you off guard and what led to that slip up and then process it and it'll just help you adjust like any relapses in the future. you mentioned the Bible. Can you share what your daily routine or spiritual disciplines look like that keep your faith strong and prevent you from slipping back into old habits? I would say God needs to be everything to you. you can't I mean you just can't get through life in general, but you much less an addiction and recovering from an addiction without being in God's word daily. To the best of my ability, I try to spend time in the actual Bible. I think there's other resources that are good, like podcasts and sermons and stuff, but they're fillers, they're not as good as actually opening up the Bible, reading directly from God's word and asking Him to speak to you. That's the best thing you can do, and that's what I try to do as much as I can. Daily, it doesn't always look as deep and as long as I'd like it to. I have young kids at home, and so just realistically, I get interrupted and I get rushed some days. there's another resource that I really like that's called the Worship Initiative. If you just look it up online, you can subscribe and it's a free devotional that will get sent right to your phone. it comes to me daily, so I don't have to really think about it. I just get a text message. notification on my phone and it's a worship song and devotional. I usually will play it right away in the morning when I'm getting dressed. if for some reason I didn't get to open up my Bible, I'm still getting fed God's word in some way. the more you do this, the more you find it's just hard to get through the day without really thinking about God or bringing him up in conversation. With my kids at home, I just try as much as I can to make God part of Everyday conversation. for example, we're outside and we're playing and I'll be like, do you guys see that beautiful bird sitting on that branch? And I'll say, Who made that bird? And they'll say, God, Does God love that bird? And yes. Well, how do we know? And talk about scripture of, you know, look at the birds of the year. They neither sow nor reap, no gather into barns, and yet your heavenly father feeds them. so our conversation will go on, but my point is the more time you spend with God in his word at church in Bible studies, the more you notice him everywhere. And he's just a part of every moment, like breathing. And it's just hard not to think about him. my hope is that the more you think about God, the less you start thinking about this addiction. I wholeheartedly agree. you've given us some great resources. are there any other books or specific Bible studies, podcasts, support groups, or resources that would be especially helpful for the those who have sought to surrender this addiction or any addiction? I've kind of touched on this already, but I think all addictions are always about something deeper. like someone struggling with porn, I would talk to them A little bit about porn, but I actually just wanna encourage them to dive in deeper. what is your story? what maybe trauma happened in your life? Dr. Dan Alander is pretty renowned in the field of trauma recovery. I would recommend any of his books, but the one that stands out to me is his book The Wounded Heart. It helped me make sense of why I even got caught up in porn to begin with. this book helped me get to that deeper stuff that I was using porn to cope with. Some other books I would recommend are The Body Keeps the Score by Dr. Kolk, Her Freedom Journey by Dr. Julie Slattery, Quenched by Jessica Harris, and then lastly The Scars That Have Shaped Me by Vanetha Reisner. Dan Allender actually has a podcast called the Allender Center, and so does Julie Slattery. Her pac called Java with Julie. Both are really great resources. Java with Julie talks a lot about just sexual integrity. Dan Alender, his scope is just more about just trauma recovery. So again, with addiction, I just think there's always something deeper than the surface level of the addiction. So the more you can unpack the layers of what's really going on, the better chance you have of getting rid of the addiction. Yeah, thank you. And I am familiar with a couple of those, but I think the list is great. And if you could send me those, I'll make sure they're in the podcast notes. one last question, Andrea. If you were stranded on a desert island and could only have one book of the Bible with you, which one would it be and why? This is hard, right? 'Cause we just love the Bible. The whole thing, the more you understand the Bible, the more you understand the whole thing is just it's all connected. My whole book, even though it's sixty six individuals. Like the just the story of marriage is connect is interweaved in the story of the Bible from Genesis to Revelation. you need the whole thing. And I'm not really a big fan of people parsing out sentences from the Bible of like you need it in context. But to answer your question, I will pick a book. And I will say Romans. I believe Romans is the most saturated with a clear gospel message. Romans is the most direct and clear about why we even need a savior. In Romans, you'll find the need for salvation. Romans three twenty-three says, All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. But then you get God's provision. Romans five eight. God demonstrates his own love for us in this, while we were still sinners. Christ died for us. It tells us how to receive salvation. Romans 10, 9 through 10. If you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. And then finally, what is the result of salvation? Romans 6:23, the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. And I just never get tired of that message. So I feel like that would be what I'd be clinging to. And also lastly, Romans just offers a lot of hope for heartache and suffering in this world. Romans 818. Yet what we suffer now is nothing compared to the glory he will reveal in us. so Romans would be my book. I think there's a lot of heartache and suffering that your listeners are going through, that you and I are going through. But This verse of like it's nothing compared to the glory. My whole story is not about me in a porn addiction and that's where it ends. It's about the redemption. And God is doing something new. He's renewing me day by day. And that's the message I want to share to people is whatever you're going through right now, that's not the end for you. He wants to set you free. He wants To renew you. And I've been so blessed to be able to be used by God with my story. There was a time in my life where I was just at the deepest part of me. And I thought, like, like I've already shared that no one's gonna love me, no one's gonna accept me. And then I confess it and I trust it. And God kind of turns my life around. And it's just amazing how many times He keeps using it. And every time I just surrender my story. And sometimes it's still kind of hard. Like I've been on my recovery for man, like seven years now. And there's still times where I'm a little nervous to share, but then when I do, God just always uses it. Even if the woman I'm talking to doesn't struggle with porn, she's struggling with something. And she just struggles someone that is like, I I've been there too. I know what it's like to not trust God with this. And I understand. And Here's what we can do to like just trust God a little more today. And when I do that, when I have those conversations, God always blesses them. we feel so close and connected. it's a beautiful thing. And that's the story of redemption. Such a beautiful story. And I'm so grateful that you shared it with us today. I think you said it and I want to reiterate it that this is not the end of your story. This is the beginning of your rescue. I am so truly thrilled to have everyone who is listening to this addicted to God podcast, who's along with us on this addicted to God journey and is a part of this addicted to God movement. Learning to trade every harmful addiction for the only one that truly satisfies Jesus Christ and his living word, as so eloquently put today with Andrea and her story and the powerful message of redemption that she is giving all glory to God. I just can't thank you enough, Andrea. So if today's episode stirred something in you, would you please share it with someone who is stuck or feeling hopeless? You never know how God might use it to spark their freedom and change their life. And of course, I really do want to stay connected to you. You can find me on Instagram at Sarah Annie underscore author. I'm on YouTube, and that is at Sarah Annie Schneider, addicted to God. I am really enjoying the conversations we're having out there in the comments. So I'm looking forward to more and more of you engaging there. Facebook, you can find me at the page Sarah Annie Schneider. I do blog at godlygirlfriends.com. I am on X at godlygirlfriends. And I would love it if you would help me find guests like Andrea who can testify and be genuine about how Jesus transformed their life. If you've experienced what it means to transfer your addiction to him. Then I sincerely would love to hear your story. Email me at addicted to Godpod at gmail.com. And as we close, sincerely I ask that you would remember that you are not defined by your past or your struggles. And when you transfer your addictions to God, He becomes the one and only healthy addiction. So God bless you, thank you for listening, and always remember to choose the better addiction. That is God.